New W/Pics of 29g. NEED HELP!!!

[kwest]

Hey guys, i did introduce myself a maybe a couple weeks ago or so, and some might have seen my thread here: http://thelittleocean.com/smf118/index.php/topic,81.15.html

But i decided to put some pics up since i found my camera. I need some help, info, and opinions please. I got a basic starter kit that came with mostly everything. The things i have added is koralia #2(will be in mail tomorrow and installed), 35lbs. of live rock, 30lbs. of live sand...I had the tank running with the factory filtration system for aprox. 3 weeks, now about 5 days with live rock installed. I checked my levels today, which may i ad i bought premixed salt from the fish store, and my salinity is at 1.028. I have a marine land kit i think its called to check the ammonia, nitrate and nitrites, its one where you put water in it, put the powder in, shake and then compare colors...Well it seems my nitrate is aprox at 10 (duno 10 what like grams or whatever) and nitrite is high it seems at 1.0...What should i do? Is this because of my live rock i added? Should i change the filter out? should i add a couple "cycling" hardy fish?

    Here's some pictures. Let me know what your thoughts on everything..Thanks!

[asommers]

adding the live rock will make it cycle. I would wait a min of a month before adding anything.

[Bergy]

yhoh.


didnt you just buy fish today???



the NITRITEs are a concern...  this means your fish will be swiming and breathing poison... and ammonia...

you will need to do water changes more frequently now or your fish maybe at risk...

This frequent water changes will not help the 'cycle' to be completed faster...  Im not sure, but i believe we tried to discuss this beofre, and that you should wait to buy fish until your nitrites were zero  and to test the water prior to going tto the lfs???

now that you didnt do that, you will have to use up more saltwater, and do more work, and still maybe lose a fish or two...

There is a certain amount of frustration when trying to communicate over hte internet in a forum, as it is not sure thing that what is written is what is understood, but ultimately it is the fish and livestock that suffer and lose...

I hope you the best of LUCK, and maybe others will pipe in and be more tactful

but for now, I suggest doing waterchanges every two to three days...

and dont add anymore livestock, fish, or corals...

Also, btw... do you understand the water change vs the top off water???

if not, please let us know so we can try to explain it..

b

[kwest]

yhoh.


didnt you just buy fish today???



the NITRITEs are a concern...  this means your fish will be swiming and breathing poison... and ammonia...

you will need to do water changes more frequently now or your fish maybe at risk...

This frequent water changes will not help the 'cycle' to be completed faster...  Im not sure, but i believe we tried to discuss this beofre, and that you should wait to buy fish until your nitrites were zero  and to test the water prior to going tto the lfs???

now that you didnt do that, you will have to use up more saltwater, and do more work, and still maybe lose a fish or two...

There is a certain amount of frustration when trying to communicate over hte internet in a forum, as it is not sure thing that what is written is what is understood, but ultimately it is the fish and livestock that suffer and lose...

I hope you the best of LUCK, and maybe others will pipe in and be more tactful

but for now, I suggest doing waterchanges every two to three days...

and dont add anymore livestock, fish, or corals...

Also, btw... do you understand the water change vs the top off water???

if not, please let us know so we can try to explain it..

b

yes i guess things can be misunderstood on the internet, because i havent bought or added any fish. lol, what you see in my tank is whats in it. just live rock and live sand. I was told by my fish store that i should get a couple of damsels because they are real hardy, and due to the beneficial waste they produce it would cycle my tank and eventually get my water parameters correct...

And i believe i know the difference between water changes and topping off the water. Water change is where i take aprox 10gallons of water syphoned out and replace with new pre mixed salt water, correct? and topping the water off is just done by adding non salt water, correct?

[Just_Greg]

no, No, NO...do NOT cycle your tank with live fish!  that's VERY "old school", and there's no reason for it...especially these days.  ammonia literally burns a fish's gills (if you've ever sniffed a bottle of ammonia, you'll get what i mean).  besides, damsels are nasty little fish, and often pick on their tankmates (and they're a PITA to remove). if you want to kick start the cycle, you can dump in some Super-Bac, which i've had very good luck with.

if you have nitrites in your water, your cycle is progressing.  once the nitrites go down,  you'll want to feed the tank (a normal feeding for the first fish you plan on adding...if unsure, a cube of frozen mysis is good), test for ammonia after about 2-4 hours, and see how the tank handles it (which means you need to retest a few times over a 12 hour period).  you're looking for how long it takes for the ammonia to reach zero.

[kwest]

no, No, NO...do NOT cycle your tank with live fish!  that's VERY "old school", and there's no reason for it...especially these days.  ammonia literally burns a fish's gills (if you've ever sniffed a bottle of ammonia, you'll get what i mean).  besides, damsels are nasty little fish, and often pick on their tankmates (and they're a PITA to remove). if you want to kick start the cycle, you can dump in some Super-Bac, which i've had very good luck with.

if you have nitrites in your water, your cycle is progressing.  once the nitrites go down,  you'll want to feed the tank (a normal feeding for the first fish you plan on adding...if unsure, a cube of frozen mysis is good), test for ammonia after about 2-4 hours, and see how the tank handles it (which means you need to retest a few times over a 12 hour period).  you're looking for how long it takes for the ammonia to reach zero.

well i havent tested the ammonia in the tank, give me a few moments and ill go do that now. Thanks for the heads up. im just trying to do everything the right way!!! lol

[Bergy]

heheh, exactly... i absolutely read that you got two fish... phew... sorry...

and yes, you got the wc and top off correct... make sure you always have fresh water on hand for top off... you will lose water every day... (I use 2-4 gallons daily... but i have a unique situation/setup)

and +1 for what greg offered

[kwest]

Just tested the Ammonia, here are the results:





To me, the color coding looks like 0.0, but in the pics i think it could show up as 0.2. What you think?

[kwest]

heheh, exactly... i absolutely read that you got two fish... phew... sorry...

and yes, you got the wc and top off correct... make sure you always have fresh water on hand for top off... you will lose water every day... (I use 2-4 gallons daily... but i have a unique situation/setup)

and +1 for what greg offered

when you say always have fresh water on hand, and losing water everyday. Then i should just buy a gallon of fresh water at a grocery store, and then i can just simply pour it in the tank? it mixes in the saltwater itself?

[Just_Greg]

i don't see any blue tinge in the pic of your NH3 test vial, so it is zero or nearly so.

as for the fresh water, here's the skinny:

the water in your tank will evaporate over time.  however, the salt WON'T evaporate, and the salinity of your tank will rise. therefore, you will need to replace this evaporated water with fresh water to maintain the proper salinity level (i usually run 1.023 SG).  you can buy gallon jugs of  RO/DI water at the supermarket, or most LFS have it as well.

the easiest way to do this is put a mark at the waterline on the outside of your sump or tank with a marker, and simply maintain that water level.  some tanx evap more than others, so you will eventually get a feel for your system.  if you run fans to cool the tank in the summer, be aware that this will increase the evaporation rate greatly (evaporative cooling).  oh, if you run a sump, simply add water to the pump section of the sump.

HTH

[kwest]

i don't see any blue tinge in the pic of your NH3 test vial, so it is zero or nearly so.

as for the fresh water, here's the skinny:

the water in your tank will evaporate over time.  however, the salt WON'T evaporate, and the salinity of your tank will rise. therefore, you will need to replace this evaporated water with fresh water to maintain the proper salinity level (i usually run 1.023 SG).  you can buy gallon jugs of  RO/DI water at the supermarket, or most LFS have it as well.

the easiest way to do this is put a mark at the waterline on the outside of your sump or tank with a marker, and simply maintain that water level.  some tanx evap more than others, so you will eventually get a feel for your system.  if you run fans to cool the tank in the summer, be aware that this will increase the evaporation rate greatly (evaporative cooling).  oh, if you run a sump, simply add water to the pump section of the sump.

HTH

does regular bottled water you buy at the grocey store due? what do RO/DI stand for? And as for standing, seemed things are doing better. I visited my local fish store and was gonig to look into doing the fish bait thing yal spoke of, but after talking over with the owner about my tank, i went ahead and went old school and got a couple of blacktailed damsels to help cycle my tank. They have been in the tank for about 8 hours so far today, and have done great. so far atleast. I feed them earlier some garlic flakes i picked up, and they ate it up real quick. So ill keep it like this for now, monitor things daily, and go from there. Still unsure what species im going to go with next, or plants, or anything. My koralia 2 will be here tomorrow, so ima install that. that should help a ton....

[psykokid]

If you are buying water from the market then get distilled water. The regular drinking water may be just carbon filtered tap water or have other minerals added for taste which you may not want in your tank. Read the label, it will usually tell you what it is. RO/DI stands for Reverse Osmosis / De Ionized . Its a filtration system that removes the impurities from the water and makes it safe to put in your tank. Most fish stores tend to sell RO water for those that dont have space for their own filter systems. Just watch out for the amount of stuff in the water (referred to as TDS or total dissolved soilds) more is bad less is good. My tap water at home is about 300, the water i get for my tank is usually around 2-5, anything less than 10 is usually acceptable.

Damsels can be mean little fish. In order to get them out of your tank if they become aggressive towards their tank mates you do realize you are going to have to possibly tear down your rock work and stress out everything in the tank to get them out. I'm not going to preach to you about your decision. Others here gave you their input as to the "old school" method of tank cycling and it being an un necessary step.

Just a word of advice, heed tips and advice others give. If you don't listen they may not be so forthcoming in the future with help if you end up doing what they said not to do in the first place.. The old preaching on deaf ears. I know thats one of the pet peeves bill has with all experts. People come in and ask for advice then don't listen to the advice being given and do what they want anyhow. When it goes upside down they come back asking for help again to fix something they shouldnt have done in the first place.

[kwest]

If you are buying water from the market then get distilled water. The regular drinking water may be just carbon filtered tap water or have other minerals added for taste which you may not want in your tank. Read the label, it will usually tell you what it is. RO/DI stands for Reverse Osmosis / De Ionized . Its a filtration system that removes the impurities from the water and makes it safe to put in your tank. Most fish stores tend to sell RO water for those that dont have space for their own filter systems. Just watch out for the amount of stuff in the water (referred to as TDS or total dissolved soilds) more is bad less is good. My tap water at home is about 300, the water i get for my tank is usually around 2-5, anything less than 10 is usually acceptable.

Damsels can be mean little fish. In order to get them out of your tank if they become aggressive towards their tank mates you do realize you are going to have to possibly tear down your rock work and stress out everything in the tank to get them out. I'm not going to preach to you about your decision. Others here gave you their input as to the "old school" method of tank cycling and it being an un necessary step.

Just a word of advice, heed tips and advice others give. If you don't listen they may not be so forthcoming in the future with help if you end up doing what they said not to do in the first place.. The old preaching on deaf ears. I know thats one of the pet peeves bill has with all experts. People come in and ask for advice then don't listen to the advice being given and do what they want anyhow. When it goes upside down they come back asking for help again to fix something they shouldnt have done in the first place.

thanks for the first half and not for the second half of the b.s. Who said i would be removing them? maybe i like them and would like to keep them, and maybe im just going to put fish that will co-operate with the damsels i purchased. You know just because i might not done things EXACTLY how you have chose to do them, doesn't make me wrong or give you the right to harrass and rant on over an online forum. What i do, sir, is ask questions, research, have conversations with people, buy books and read, gather information, and then form a plan on what i think is best for me. Which according to my local fish store that keeps track of thousands of gallons worth of aqariums including every doctors office in my area, plus the 3 $30 books i have purchased, I made a good decision. So to everyone else, especially bergy, thanks for the help.

[psykokid]

Sorry to have drawn your ire, not my intent. When you said you were going to cycle your tank the "old school" i was under the impression you intended to do it the "old school" way. That way is to get some fish some see as disposable such as damsels and let them do their thing then get rid of them when you are ready to add more stock. I didnt see anything in your post to the contrary. I guess thats what happens when you assume. Im a big enough person to admit when im wrong, and it appears that i was in this case with my assumption. cest la vie..

You know the old un PC saying, there's more than one way to skin a cat, well same goes in here. Do what works for you, have fun and dont let the bastards grind you down :)

[Bergy]

kwest, please understand that even though this forum is dead and not busy, we have done most everything you have and are doing.  We have also been on forum and dealt with lots of reefers that do what PK said...  I think you would agree that at some point frustration will ocmein when good info and suggestions are not heeded, and the choices become shut and let them find out on thier own, or try one last time to communicate the info, maybe in a different approach in hoping that way will be more effective.

None of us are professional speakers or teachers or communicators, especially when it comes to conversing via shorthand/intenet lingo and methodology..

PK doesnt have a negative/angry bone in him.. He would never INTEND on being confrontational or offensive..  He, like me, maybecome 'excited/enthused/focused/passionate in our methods and attempts, but again, not, no way, in any way in any manner  to put you or anyone down...

And with that, i hope we all step back from whatever position there may or may not be, and carry forward... and crack a joke!! NOW!!!!